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Ceevro

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Thoughts while listening:

Hmm...certainly better than most 8-bit videogame tunes I hear tossed out here on NG. Sounds like you've put some real effort in. Really simple lead-line, but it works well. Certainly a good videogame track. Could be used in pretty much any genre of game! Really long silence at the end. Perhaps you need to trim...

Thoughts after listening:

Some improvements;

-Considering this is a videogame track, it would be really handy to make it a loop, rather than a complete song. Just a thought.
-Could use a bridge, to mix things up. Once you've heard the first minute, you've kinda heard the whole song.

Some good things;

-I still loved the atmosphere...could be used just about anywhere. I mean, I can't really think of a genre of game that this couldn't work for! Maybe Animal Crossing might not be the best place, but other than that...
-Well mixed! Your levels are top-notch, and there was no ear-grindage anywhere.
-I loved the simplicity of the lead-line. Many people seem to make a good rhythm section, then completely miss putting in a lead, mostly because they can't really compose, I suspect. You, however, took three notes and a rhythm and made it work. Mad props!

Overall, solid track. Simple, effective, and universal. Could use a little mix-up, but considering that you're trying to create a steady drive for a boss fight, that's not entirely a bad thing!

3.5/5, R4R
-Ceevro

SoTJake responds:

Thanks :)
I was considering making this a loop but as you already stated, it is pretty repetitive after a short while and really needs a bridge, so a loop would have hurt this track more than it would have helped, imo.

Thoughts while listening:

15 seconds is a loooong time to wait for the song to start. Can't say I'm a big fan of the faux guitar sound...the highs are a bit too ear-stabby. Anyways...compositionally - decent chord progression, some nice change-ups at about 1:40. I know how finicky that can be to mix in. I'm kinda wanting some more instrumentation here. Can't hear any bass. Nice bridge at 2:50. And a 15 second silent outro. Perhaps my speakers are missing something, being labtec computer speakers that came with the Dell I'm currently using...

Thoughts after listening:

Some improvements;

-Needs a more complete instrumentation. You've completely filled the highs, but I'm hearing almost nothing in the lows and low-mids.
-Mix is a bit off. You have to bring out your pads a bit more to make sure they're providing the soundscape you need for your chord progression.
-Where's the lead line? At this point, what you have is a drummer and a rhythm guitar and a pad. Bands are put together the way they are for a reason - everything you have here is great, but you gotta use it to support a melody! I want a singer or lead guitar or something! What you've got is a backtrack. It's a start.

Some good points;

-Chord progression is good. Catchy overall, certainly something I'd like to solo over.
-Beat is solid, nicely put together, simple...but that's not a bad thing.
-Loved the changups. You can certainly mess with it a bit more, but at present, it's workable.

Overall, I see this as a start, not a finished product. Doesn't mean you should give up on it, but if you wanna make this really pop, it requires more work, IMHO.

3/5

-Ceevro

DESHIEL responds:

You are right man, thank you for your input ;)

Awww...that's awesome! We gotta collab on a rap sometime! I love the humour and self-depreciation just as much as the flow!

SonicWombat responds:

Hell yeah, man! I'm down to clown with that!

Thoughts while listening:

Mix is extremely quiet. Check your settings, you may have 'normalize volume' on, which basically halves the volume. Electric guitar is overpowering the mix. Just a little too harsh in the mix. Enjoying the ambient backtrack. Awkward guitar solo at 1:30 actually adds to the mysterious sounds. Like it. Really late to add the waa pedal, near the end of the song...

Thoughts after listening:

Some improvements;
-Consider reducing the guitar in the mix. It's a bit too heavy, and the amount of distortion will still make it jump out.
-Kill the waa, or extend it's part in the song. It's an interesting effect, but you introduce the element so late in the song that it feels out of place...leaves me wondering why on earth it's there.
-Check your volumes. I had the same problem until I figured out that the default setting on my DAW was "Normalize Volume," which would put the loudest sound at max volume, reducing everything else. As percussion is generally associated with volume spikes unless the whole track is massively compressed, this results in the whole project sounding half as loud as it should in the final version. That's just one possible issue, but perhaps it could be some other problem.

Some good things;

-Love the back track. Suitably...curious. Feels like a city night scene in a ninja movie.
-Great dissonance in your guitar playing. For a second, I thought you had simply played a wrong note, but once I realized that you were going for that awkward, cringe-inducing tone, I kinda fell in love with it.

Overall, a decent track. Not bad here. Certainly no issues beyond easy fixes, and a really unique type of sound.

3.5/5, R4R

-Ceevro

IndustryStandard responds:

Yeah I'm getting a general consensus that the guitar is a little too overpowering - either too fuzzy or too loud, so I'm thinking I'll either bring it down in the mix, or rerecord the part using my blues driver instead of my big muff if that doesn't work.

I really wouldn't want to take out the wah, although I agree it could be used a little more... That's going to take some more contemplating on my part, but I'll definitely keep it in mind.

I wouldn't go so far as to say dissonance is "my thing" because that makes it sound like I know what I'm doing, but it is by far one of my favorite musical techniques and I'm always happy when I find someone else who appreciates it.

Thanks for the advice!

Thoughts while listening:

Yes, very Floyd-esque...nice filled-out sound. And it's good to hear a whole band playing here on NG...not many actual bands here. Ahhh...live-drummer...sniff...getting misty-eyed here. Whoever is working that keyboard actually has a very good feel for the long-winded-type of solo common to Pink Floyd. Slap-bass at 3:30 is a nice touch. Change-up at 4:00 is nice and tight. Hallmark of a good band with lots of practice. Bass solo at 5:05 is...well...I have a personal beef with bass solos...probably because I'm a guitarist. Not sold on the bass solo going over 30 seconds, either. Vocal at 06:50 is utterly incoherant, and the effect is so compressed it feels like it isn't even in the same room. Nice clean guitar at 08:00. This tune is going all over the place, isn't it? Nice electric addition at 09:12. It's rare to have a distorted guitar sound good as lead over an undistorted one, and your bassist is filling it out wonderfully. Impressive skills at 10:30 on that elec.! Props to the lead player. Really long fade-out time. Like, a full minute to fade-out.

Thoughts after listening:

First, I'll say up front that I appreciate the difficulty in live-playing something of this length and complexity, and I understand that you probably won't be redoing this anytime soon. This is to help future recordings...

Some improvements;
-Your drummer is juuuuuuuuusssst slightly off. You can especially hear it when he/she comes in, slightly behind the beat, then hurries to catch up. Usually I find that this is a confidence thing.
-There were times when it dragged a little more than it needed to. Your lead guitarist is damn good, but I feel that, especially on multiple repeats of the same arpeggio, he was stalling for time, rather than adding to the solo.
-The vocal shouldn't be there. It distracted from the playing, sounded awful, and didn't add anything to the piece. As well, the FX on it made it sound totally disjointed, like it was being played on a TV turned up too-loud in the next room.

Some good things;

-This was compositionally and stylistically excellent. You and your band really captured the sound you were after.
-The performance was tight, with the band holding together through some very challenging changes.
-I don't smoke-up, but a pop-up window came up on my PC and offered to dispense a joint.

Overall, damn solid track. If you guys can play like that live, you've got a career ahead of you. Excellent work.

4.5/5, R4R

-Ceevro

AnOrdinaryVision responds:

Thanks. Actually, as I said in another reply, this song was recorded 1 year ago, and we didn't have good gear for recording (we usually record ourselves, don't want to spend lots on money for something that will probably heard by 10 people) and our newest recording, which is also uploaded on NG, is a lot better. I agree with most of your points, the vocals were a mistake.

Thoughts while listening:
Flow is better. Hi-hat has been cleaned up. MUCH better pacing! Makes the time/beat change at 1:20 fit in better. The "through the wall" effect at 1:40 works well. Piano at 2:10 all by itself...sweet! Build-up at 3:00 is working well with the additional melodic line. Much improved. The piano sticks out brilliantly here!

Thoughts after listening;

Not going to go with the good/bad points thing here...we've done that already. What I will say is that this cleaned up wonderfully! You kept it interesting the whole way through, cleaned-up the sound, improved the piano and really made it stand out, and turned this into a proper epic-sounding track! Normally, I push people to include some vocals, which you could still totally do, but here I don't really think it's necessary, as your piano solo kept things interesting as a lead-line.

And good on ya for doing what so few do: Taking criticism and using it to improve. You did not mess around on this, you simply heard the feedback and fixed the problems. Mad props, ChromaShift!

5/5
-Ceevro

ChromaShift responds:

Thanks for another review :D glad the track improved in a positive way :D Yeah, I always say on other platforms that they can criticize my tracks, because I can improve that way, but it isn't happening, nobody cares or nobody took the time to write a review. Because of that I'm glad you left a review for me to read, it helped me a lot :D

This is also a thing, if you get some advice, you should try to improve your track, if you don't do that you keep making the same mistakes. I don't want to make the same mistakes again and listened to my track over 4 times, after that I noticed that it's quite boring to have so much repetitions of the same chords or melodies, also that my buildup of the track was quite long and didn't create any tension. So I fixed that, thanks again,

-Shift

Thoughts while listening: Great piano intro, loving the syncopated rhythms! Lots of great changeups...aaaaaaand it's over! What?

Thoughts after listening;

Some improvements;
-This is an amazing start, but it's only a start. You should really flesh this idea out.
-Not sold on the buzzy synth thing. Too much of the song is done with realistic-sounding instruments, so the synth feels really out of place.

Some good things;
-Awesome rhythms here! Very dynamic, and original.
-Great changups. This doesn't give me time to get bored before you throw something totally new into the mix.
-Excellent piano playing. I don't know if you've programmed it in, or if you can actually play like that, but either way, it's perfectly composed.

Overall, this is a great start! Like something for a rock-opera. I would really be interested in hearing a more complete version. Please develop this! If possible, you might wanna get a vocal section involved....I think that MetalRenard here on NG is a good rock vocalist. Make this into a full-on piece! You have Ceevro's stamp of approval! Which is worth...uh...*checks pockets* $0.73, a black bic lighter, and some lint!

4/5, come participate in the "Review for Review" audio-forum thread, and share some of your knowledge and talent with us!

-Ceevro

Czyszy responds:

Wow! Thanks so much for the detailed feedback. :D

Thoughts while listening:
Sounds a little more like a shopping theme than a tavern theme, but that's just me. At least the chord progression is a bit more interesting than most. Nice transition at 1:10. Seems like you've got two solos going on between the strings and the piano at the same time. Works well as a loop, though.

Thoughts after listening, while letting the loop go:

Some improvements;
-Would like a more realistic-sounding piano. The midi you have there is close, but just a little too...early electric piano sound.
-Would like a bit more change in the dynamics.

Some good things;
-Nice work on the percussion. Keeps the changes coming, appropriate fills, etc.
-Excellent soloing work. They go where you want 'em, and have a point and a build to them.

Overall, I didn't get a tavern feel, but rather a more energetic feel...sort of the background music I'd expect at the mall. This isn't a condemnation of the piece, but just noting that it didn't feel to me like where you wanted it to be. Take that as you will. You do have a very solidly composed piece here. As good as any professional composition, really. I think that what it's lacking is more realistic instrumentation, to really bring it into the pro-realm. Give it some consideration.

4/5, R4R

-Ceevro

Jernemies responds:

Thanks for the critique :)

That's an interesting perspective about the shopping thing, never though about it that way. I still don't, but I guess it's not that far from what could go with it.
Fair points about the piano and instrumentation, but also in this case: "Eh, could be worse." Noted for the future though.

Thoughts while listening:
Ugh, that hissing/ringing sound is killing me! Chord progression is good. Epic-type pacing. Waiting for something overtop of the chords. Timing mixup at 1:30 is confusing me...does make for interesting listening though. Finally, a change at 2:45 to piano, with a melody line and everything! OK...full minute of the same two notes is a bit much. And now you're simply putting all the parts together. Something of a melody going at 5:30.

Thoughts after listening:

Some Improvements;
-This song takes way too long to make it's point. The chord progression shouldn't go through 24 bars to establish itself. Look back at your mix, and anytime that you have the exact same thing playing for more than two loops, delete the extra loops.
-The hissing/ringing sound you had at the beginning made my ears bleed a little. You might think about some more tight sounds to use for percussion. A long-ringing sound makes a good cymbal, but it shouldn't be used as a hi-hat.
-The two-note piano build takes way too many repititions to fall into the rhythm section, where you eventually put it. Make the switch, and don't keep us in sus...

Some good things;
-Epic-type sound.
-Honestly, the piano solo could stand on it's own as an instrumental. Well-done.
-Some really skillful mixups in the rhythm, and effectively used.

Overall, this piece has the sound your were going for, it just takes twice as much time as it needs to take to get there.

3/5, R4R

-Ceevro

ChromaShift responds:

Thank you for this detailed review and some things that will help me to improve. I edited my track and uploaded it on my profile, maybe it's better this time :D
Also thank you for a honest review because this helps me much more than just a 5 stars voting without mentioning why.

-Shift

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Joined on 7/7/05

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